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 Post subject: Re: GarryG Does Stations
PostPosted: 04 Sep 2017, 05:08 
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Hello Pal,

Been playing around with the transparency in fences.

This Waypoint is using fences with wire mesh.

Can see the train through the fence wire.
Attachment:
Test Fences1.png
Test Fences1.png [ 32.96 KiB | Viewed 1260 times ]


These the sprites of two types. Top one is suppose to be metal bars. Bottom one is the wire mesh.
Attachment:
Test Fences Sprites.png
Test Fences Sprites.png [ 2.99 KiB | Viewed 1260 times ]

If like try the waypoint for your self will find is this file.

Cheers pal


Attachments:
auzstations_4_v001.grf [1.54 MiB]
Downloaded 35 times

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 Post subject: Re: GarryG Does Stations
PostPosted: 06 Sep 2017, 14:48 
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Hi Friend,

Looking for ideas and opinions. And I know your a good bloke to ask these of :mrgreen:

As mentioned before thinking of changing all my station sets so each platform type is in its own set.

If I do this and give them a new name .. what if call them AuzNSWStations.

The designs are all from my State.

1/ The Gravel Platforms and maybe combine them with the Gravel and Bitumen platforms and call these .. AuzNSWStationsEarlyPlatforms .. something like that.

2/ The Bitumen with out white lines AuzNSWStationsCountryPlatforms

3/ Bitumen with White Lines AuzNSWStationsSuburbanPlatforms

4/ Tile platforms .. AuzNSWStationsCityPlatforms.

5/ The freight stations and Infrastructure could go under AusNSWFreightandInfrastructure.

Or an idea a friend told me here in Aussie land. Give them years when those sets become available.

1a/ Gravel Platforms AuzStationsfrom1850s

2a/ Gravel and Bitumen and all Bitumen AuzStationsfrom1900s

3a/ Bitumen with white lines .. AuzStationsfrom 1960s. (Maybe 1040s as that when first used during World War II)

4a/ Tile Platforms AusStationsfrom1990s

We do have some concrete platforms, but these mainly used on older stations that been upgraded and platforms been altered. But leave the concrete ones for you.

Been searching the internet for old photos of some stations I been visiting past few weeks.

Hope to do a old version and a modern version to many of them.

When I eventually do Sydney, I thinking to make the curved roof concourse area see through roof.

I know it not all see through in real, but be nice to see the work I do to the buildings.

Cheers pal .. I off to dream world

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 Post subject: Re: GarryG Does Stations
PostPosted: 06 Sep 2017, 21:58 
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First off, I think this question should also be asked over at the OpenTTD-forums.
People who are actually playing with your sets may have a better/different opinion than me ;-)

I would advise to go with your first option, so sorting them out in platformstyles/types.
The advantage of that rather than sorting them out in years is that for example you may have difficulty with placing certain stationbuildings.
Lets take Sydney, as I gathered from Wikipedia that station in more or less its current shape opened in 1906. If you know that, then you know you have to search for it in AuzStationsfrom1900s, but if you dont know that it will be harder to find it.
However I would easily find it in AuzNSWStationsCityPlatforms, as that sounds as a logical place to find it.
Further more, what are you going to do with additions/enlargements of stations added in later years?
Add those separately in for example AuzStationsfrom1960s?

I think it is better to split up in platformstyles rather then years.... But that is just my opinion... :oops:


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 Post subject: Re: GarryG Does Stations
PostPosted: 07 Sep 2017, 00:02 
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Glad I asked your opinion as your think of things that I didn't :oops:

And when you mentioned buildings that reminded me that it will be a problem too as most buildings I doing designed to go with any platform.

Oooh well .. Stick to the way I doing them.

Thanks again pal

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 Post subject: Re: GarryG Does Stations
PostPosted: 09 Sep 2017, 14:31 
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Been having a break from drawings and coding and been searching the web for photos of old stations and came across this photo and a few other from different angles.
Attachment:
Killingworth Collerie 1903 Coal Loading.png
Killingworth Collerie 1903 Coal Loading.png [ 250.11 KiB | Viewed 1253 times ]


I will see if I can make it with platform normal tiles first .. this way players can extend the loading area to suit the trains, but if that don't work how easier would it be for you to code it like your locos sheds?

The buildings that don't have the railway lines see if can make these as non track tiles and might need help as I think these will be 2 tiles wide and not sure yet what length.

Killingworth is where I live .. outer suburb of Newcastle. This coal mine was about 500 metres away and the railway line going to the mines was about 100 metres from where I live.

But it all gone now .. just the mound where the railway line was and the coal mine replaced by a timber yard.

Cheers pal

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 Post subject: Re: GarryG Does Stations
PostPosted: 10 Sep 2017, 10:19 
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Here the start of making the Coal Loader.

Made them as Island Platforms and these in 3 parts.. 1st part has the slant roof and next 2 parts the same. Designed so can make as long as want.

Now I see if I can do the building at back in photo that roof goes opposite directions.

Took a while to make these and roof started to go rusty.

Cheers


Attachments:
Coal Loader.png
Coal Loader.png [ 35.5 KiB | Viewed 1252 times ]

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 Post subject: Re: GarryG Does Stations
PostPosted: 10 Sep 2017, 12:22 
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Quote:
Here the start of making the Coal Loader.

That looks very nice!
In this thread I try to refrain from commenting on graphics, as code is more important here, but I do have a question.
What is that dark area under the loaders? Is it supposed to be coal that has fallen next to the trains?
If that is the case then I think it is a bit too much...
It looks more like a very heavy shadow. (if it is supposed to be shadow, then I dont think you should do that by the way)
If it is surplus coal, then it would look better if that is heavy around the tracks (so where normally ballast is visible) and a bit scattered towards the outsides, that may look a bit more "natural"

Quote:
The buildings that don't have the railway lines see if can make these as non track tiles and might need help as I think these will be 2 tiles wide and not sure yet what length.

Let me know when you know what size they will be, then I will make the code for that for you.


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 Post subject: Re: GarryG Does Stations
PostPosted: 10 Sep 2017, 14:21 
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Hi pal,

Main reason I put this photo here is not sure if it allowed .. this is what written with the image on internet.

Code:
This image was scanned from the original glass negative taken by Ralph Snowball. It is part of the Norm Barney Photographic Collection, held by Cultural Collections at the University of Newcastle, NSW, Australia.
 
This image can be used for study and personal research purposes. If you wish to reproduce this image for any other purpose you must obtain permission by contacting the University of Newcastle's Cultural Collections.


So am I allowed to put the photo on the forums for the world to see?

The coal on ground see if I can do what you reckon .. .. what out side of the building should be more natural as you said with maybe the odd coal laying here and there.

What you reckon .. would you like to continue the studies? Cause I could take weeks and longer to make things with what you taught me so far .. really enjoying it as you might have noticed.

But maybe we should do more of the course so you can then publish this for others to follow.

cheers

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 Post subject: Re: GarryG Does Stations
PostPosted: 10 Sep 2017, 15:08 
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So am I allowed to put the photo on the forums for the world to see?

I think it is kind of ok, the disclaimer is I think more focussed on if the image is going to be used in a book or on a website (so with a more commercial use).
However, to be sure, just linking to the image is the safest ;-)
Quote:
But maybe we should do more of the course so you can then publish this for others to follow.

I agree, but my time at the moment is limited and I want to use some time I have to work on my Dutch Station Set.
Ill see what things I still want to publish here (I think it is handy if I place some sort of to-do list in the first post, so I can keep track and also links towards the several "lessons" in this thread in the first post), before it could go "public".
But I dont mind giving you some custom codes and graphics-templates sometimes, when you really need them, so you can continue your great work!


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 Post subject: Re: GarryG Does Stations
PostPosted: 10 Sep 2017, 15:16 
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Just about heading to bed.

I put it on other forum and ask there too see what some of those who made that forum might say .. I also sent a email to the people involved with those photos. There are several types of coal loaders back in the very early 1900s which I think will look good in game. Lots of stations there too.

What if what you have taught me to date be released as Part 1? And just mention part 2 be available eventually.

Maybe the Flashing Lights, the Animation and some or all of the long tile sets could be left out. The 2x1 and longer leave for Part 2.

Part 1 just the basics for now.

Any way my friend I heading to dream world.

Cheers

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 Post subject: Re: GarryG Does Stations
PostPosted: 10 Sep 2017, 18:39 
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I think the best way to go is to keep everything inside this single thread, as you dont have to search anywhere else, all is here.

Wally may know this, but I am hoping that it is possible eventually for an admin to move this thread then to somewhere in the more public part of Simuscape, so that others can benefit from this information, but more importantly can take the same road to learning coding stations like you have done. As the step by step approach we did, is in my opinion a very good way to get into station-coding.


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 Post subject: Re: GarryG Does Stations
PostPosted: 11 Sep 2017, 00:25 
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The way you have explained it to me .. every one else should understand it as I not the easiest too teach. :mrgreen:

Must admit I had to read and read something several times for it to sink in then practice till I got it right and practice more so not need to refer back to the instructions.

I sent a email to see if get permission to use the photos and got his rely this morning.

Quote:
Hi Garry,

Thanks for your email.

That’s fine by us.

Regards,

Gionni

MR GIONNI DI GRAVIO
University Archivist
Chair, Hunter (Living) Histories Initiative
Councillor, Australian Society of Archivists (ASA)
Australian Society of Archivists Accredited Professional (ASAAP)
Cultural Collections (Archives)
Auchmuty Library


So boy am I going to have some fun now.

Cheers pal

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 Post subject: Re: GarryG Does Stations
PostPosted: 11 Sep 2017, 04:39 
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Quast65 wrote:
I think the best way to go is to keep everything inside this single thread, as you dont have to search anywhere else, all is here.

Wally may know this, but I am hoping that it is possible eventually for an admin to move this thread then to somewhere in the more public part of Simuscape, so that others can benefit from this information, but more importantly can take the same road to learning coding stations like you have done. As the step by step approach we did, is in my opinion a very good way to get into station-coding.
I think I can do this. I have been able to do something similar in other parts of Simuscape. 8-)

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 Post subject: Re: GarryG Does Stations
PostPosted: 11 Sep 2017, 14:16 
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Quote:
I think I can do this. I have been able to do something similar in other parts of Simuscape.

Thats good to know Wally, cheers! :W
Quote:
The way you have explained it to me .. every one else should understand it as I not the easiest too teach.

Dont sell yourself too short mate! ;-)
You have picked this up really quick and look what you are coming up with! Not just with what you have coded so far, but also the ideas you are coming up with by thinking about what may be possible by using the information posted here! :bowing:


Ill start out with making a sort of index in the first post, with links to the various "lessons".
But also a to-do list (with information I still want to share, you may not use that all, but then I have shared all my current knowledge) and a wish-list with custom things you may need for your projects.
EDIT: The first post now has an Index, to-do list and request-list


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 Post subject: Re: GarryG Does Stations
PostPosted: 15 Sep 2017, 09:17 
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I have a bit of spare time, so I am going to try to tick off a couple of things from the To-Do list ;-)
These may be things you wont use (or at least not at the moment), but that I do want to share before this thread gets placed in a public section.

Note, that from now on I wont be including the "old fashioned" see-thru glass graphics in the graphics-templates and code, as these can better be done in the 32bpp graphics (as then you can also use different colors and/or textures for those).
Later on I will also explain how you can remove references to the old see-thru graphics and code needed for them in the previous templates I gave you.
You dont have to do that by the way (the only thing is that it just makes the GRFs a bit larger in size and it uses a bit more computingpower ingame, but modern computers wont have issues with that ;-) ), you can still just use those templates and code, but it is something I do want to mention for others that may be are going to use these examples and want to use a tidier/cleaner code 8-)

Ok, here we go:

Platforms with custom foundations


NOTE: this is more or less a graphics "hack" ;-)
It should be possible to code stations in such a way that they have no foundations when placed on groundlevel and custom foundations when placed on a slope.
However I do not have that knowledge but did find a way to get close to that :twisted:

Attachment:
Example359.png
Example359.png [ 72.05 KiB | Viewed 1239 times ]

Basically, what I did was just "lift" up a platform 8 pixels (one hightlevel) and then on the extra hight you can draw your custom foundations (like fake tunnelentrances, elevator shafts, shops, walls that match the platforms, whatever).
The difference between "regular" platforms and these is first (ofcourse) the graphics (so you get 8 pixels hight under the platform itself) and a difference in the relative position of the graphic in the code.

This may be a good time to explain what the numbers mean in the graphicscode:

38 c:/grfcodec603/auzstations/gfx/template_8bpp_EMPTY.png 8bpp 10 40 64 122 -31 -91 normal chunked

10 40 The X-Y position of the top-left point of that particular blue box within the graphicsfile
64 122 The X-Y size of that blue box
-31 -91 The relative X-Y position of the top-left pixel of the base of the graphic inside the blue box (so the base, groundlevel, its footprint so to say!! Not the top of any structures on it!!)
This shows better what that is:
Attachment:
Example360.png
Example360.png [ 20.54 KiB | Viewed 1239 times ]

Normally in the code we use, the graphicsinformation is then something like this:
Code:
  353 c:/grfcodec603/auzstations/gfx/template_8bpp_EMPTY.png  8bpp   10  40   64  122  -31  -91 normal chunked
    | c:/grfcodec603/auzstations/gfx/template_32bpp.png  32bpp   10    40   64  122  -31  -91 normal chunked
  354 c:/grfcodec603/auzstations/gfx/template_8bpp_EMPTY.png  8bpp   90  40   64  122  -53  -102 normal chunked
    | c:/grfcodec603/auzstations/gfx/template_32bpp.png  32bpp   90    40   64  122  -53  -102 normal chunked
  355 c:/grfcodec603/auzstations/gfx/template_8bpp_EMPTY.png  8bpp  170  40   64  122  -31  -91 normal chunked
    | c:/grfcodec603/auzstations/gfx/template_32bpp.png  32bpp   170   40   64  122  -31  -91 normal chunked
  356 c:/grfcodec603/auzstations/gfx/template_8bpp_EMPTY.png  8bpp  250  40   64  122  -9  -102 normal chunked
    | c:/grfcodec603/auzstations/gfx/template_32bpp.png  32bpp   250   40   64  122  -9  -102 normal chunked

However, in this case I drew the ground-graphics 8 pixels higher inside the blue-box, so the relative Y-positions are 8 pixels less.
So -91 becomes - 83 and -102 becomes -94.
So for platforms with custom foundations it looks like this:
Code:
  353 c:/grfcodec603/auzstations/gfx/template_8bpp_EMPTY.png  8bpp   10  40   64  122  -31  -83 normal chunked
    | c:/grfcodec603/auzstations/gfx/template_32bpp.png  32bpp   10    40   64  122  -31  -83 normal chunked
  354 c:/grfcodec603/auzstations/gfx/template_8bpp_EMPTY.png  8bpp   90  40   64  122  -53  -94 normal chunked
    | c:/grfcodec603/auzstations/gfx/template_32bpp.png  32bpp   90    40   64  122  -53  -94 normal chunked
  355 c:/grfcodec603/auzstations/gfx/template_8bpp_EMPTY.png  8bpp  170  40   64  122  -31  -83 normal chunked
    | c:/grfcodec603/auzstations/gfx/template_32bpp.png  32bpp   170   40   64  122  -31  -83 normal chunked
  356 c:/grfcodec603/auzstations/gfx/template_8bpp_EMPTY.png  8bpp  250  40   64  122  -9  -94 normal chunked
    | c:/grfcodec603/auzstations/gfx/template_32bpp.png  32bpp   250   40   64  122  -9  -94 normal chunked




Ok, a lot of blabla :help:
Not important, just extra information ;-)

Here are the code and graphics templates for platforms with custom foundations:
Attachment:
CustomFoundationsSources.rar [3.09 KiB]
Downloaded 37 times

As always, change this in the code:
- Paths/names to graphicsfiles
- Station-IDs (in this example "10")
- Purchasemenu-ID (in this example "AS06")
- The hight of the boundingboxes (to the appropriate hight of the highest structure in the tile)
- Name you want to give to the tile
- Name of Purchase Submenu
I advise to place these kind of stations in a separate purchase submenu, because they are a bit of a "hack" :oops: that way it is a bit more clear that these are a bit "special" :twisted:


EDIT 16-07-2018: GarryG has made a couple more examples:
http://www.simuscape.net/simutalk/viewtopic.php?f=84&t=881#p13245


Last edited by Quast65 on 16 Jul 2018, 16:44, edited 1 time in total.

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 Post subject: Re: GarryG Does Stations
PostPosted: 15 Sep 2017, 10:27 
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Thanks pal,

will have a look at these over the weekend. There are some stations I been visiting that are raised up so can practice with them. East Maitland is Island Platform and has the subway, Dora Creek single sided platforms and has stairs off the end ramps, and there are several stations in Sydney I can go for a train ride in coming weeks and have a look at.

This idea might be good for Sydney when I get back to it.

Cheers pal

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 Post subject: Re: GarryG Does Stations
PostPosted: 15 Sep 2017, 11:16 
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More goodies ;-)

Single-tile Non-track Overlaps
Attachment:
Example361.png
Example361.png [ 53.08 KiB | Viewed 1238 times ]

These can be used to cover up a road (or track, or waterway, whatever ;-) ), so that it looks like that road is going through a station.
If you have enough room on either side of the road, it is best to have two overlaps, one to the front and one to the back, so that the overlap is double so to say. That way glitching is a bit less, but it will certainly glitch ;-)

The green tile is the actual real stationtile, the red tile is the overlap.
In this case the overlap is at 8 pixels hight, that is the lowest it should be (to avoid busses losing their roof ;-) )

For now I will only do a single non-track stationtile with an overlap. It is possible to do multitile stations with overlaps, but that requires more time for me to do, so I will only do those on request (for example that tram-line overlap for Sydney station, when you get to that).

Templates (code & graphics):
Attachment:
NonTrackOverlaps.rar [8.27 KiB]
Downloaded 39 times


As always, change this in the code:
- Paths/names to graphicsfiles
- Station-IDs (in this example "11 & 12")
- Purchasemenu-ID (in this example "AS07")
- The hight of the boundingboxes (to the appropriate hight of the highest structure in the tile)
- Name you want to give to the tile
- Name of Purchase Submenu
I advise to place these kind of stations in a separate purchase submenu, because they are a bit of a "hack" :oops: that way it is a bit more clear that these are a bit "special" :twisted:


Last edited by Quast65 on 15 Sep 2017, 11:47, edited 1 time in total.

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 Post subject: Re: GarryG Does Stations
PostPosted: 15 Sep 2017, 11:47 
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Your making my to-do-list longer :mrgreen:

With what you shown me I should be able to do the station I once worked at. I started there in 1970.
Booking Office, parcel Office and Luggage all upstairs.


Attachments:
Broadmeadow Booking Office 1965.png
Broadmeadow Booking Office 1965.png [ 263.84 KiB | Viewed 1238 times ]

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 Post subject: Re: GarryG Does Stations
PostPosted: 15 Sep 2017, 12:15 
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Quote:
With what you shown me I should be able to do the station I once worked at.

That station should already be possible to do with the examples you already have, no need to use overlaps I think. However, looking at the size of the building and the connecting stairs, then 2x2 would be handy... (those examples I have planned, but those will probably come somewhere next week)
Overlaps should be needed if for example there was also a road under that building next to the tracks.
Or if the station had three tracks under the station (where the middle track would be for non-stop go-through trains).

Talking about that...
Next up:

Single-tile Tracked Overlaps
Attachment:
Example362.png
Example362.png [ 56.81 KiB | Viewed 1238 times ]

Basically the same as the non-track ones, but now with tracks! (duh... :lol: )

In the picture above a suggestion for its use, so you have three tracks with a roof or canopy over them, the outer ones can be used by trains to stop (as they are stations), but you want the middle track as non-stop go-through (so not at all part of a station).
Or you can use them in combination with the non-track ones (that way you can get a roof covering up a track and a road, for example).

Templates (code & graphics):
Attachment:
TrackedOverlaps.rar [7.72 KiB]
Downloaded 35 times


As always, change this in the code:
- Paths/names to graphicsfiles
- Station-IDs (in this example "13 & 14")
- Purchasemenu-ID (in this example "AS07")
- The hight of the boundingboxes (to the appropriate hight of the highest structure in the tile)
- Name you want to give to the tile
- Name of Purchase Submenu
I advise to place these kind of stations in a separate purchase submenu, because they are a bit of a "hack" :oops: that way it is a bit more clear that these are a bit "special" :twisted:

Dont use these too often though! They should only be used if for example a waypoint wont do the job.
For example, when you have a nicely curved canopy, it is easier to use the overlap than cutting the canopy up in a station and waypoint, where the player then has to search for all the parts needed to complete the canopy in various purchasemenus.


Thats it for today... ;-)
Next week I hope to have time to make some examples of multitile stations and platforms (2x2, 3x3) and then will also try to explain how the combination of tracked and non-tracked tiles in a multitile station works. 8-)


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 Post subject: Re: GarryG Does Stations
PostPosted: 15 Sep 2017, 12:58 
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Location: Newcastle, Australia
Getting exciting all these new additions you giving me.

I been swearing and cursing .. not at you .. the coal loader I been working on .. one direction is finished and started the other and had a lot done to it and the program crashed on me and lost hours of work I did .. me bad too as I know I should save regular .. but regular seems to only be when I remember to do so.

To clear room in this forum .. do you want me to go back through some of my notes and delete what not relevant to the course?

When I finish the coal loader which hope be some time tomorrow going to practice some of these things you shown me tonight.

That photo of Broadmeadow .. to the right are 2 more rail lines for freight trains .. to the left used to be a single track going to a loading dock and left of that was a road.

Cheers pal

_________________
All my projects are GPLv2 License.
Soot Happens.
Projects: viewtopic.php?f=179&t=811


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