It is currently 20 Jan 2018, 15:17

WELCOME TO SIMUSCAPE!


Please Sign in or Register to enable all features, remove restrictions and gain additional access!
For information on how to bypass the CAPTCHA or to contact Team Simuscape, Continue Here!


Post a new topicPost a reply Page 1 of 2   [ 22 posts ]
Go to page 1, 2  Next
Author Message
PostPosted: 06 Jan 2013, 19:54 
Simuscape Admin
User avatar

Joined: 15 Sep 2011, 09:25
Posts: 3025
Location: Sweden
Since I've never played OTTD I was wondering if I can safely start working on a scenario for future use, (i.e. once some features are implemented :twisted: ), and keep adding the latest nightlies without those having an impact on the scenario itself, (while still being work in progress that is, and not started as a regular game)?

_________________
Image

Simuscape - A world of its own;
SimuTalk | Visual Studio | INFRA Diary

INFRA - Chose Your Destination;
INFRA Projects | INFRA Downloads


Top
 Offline Profile  
 
PostPosted: 06 Jan 2013, 20:11 
Simuscape Admin
User avatar

Joined: 01 May 2012, 11:38
Posts: 580
Sure, I can't see that it would be any problems.

_________________
Image

Simuscape
Site Admin & Developer


Top
 Offline Profile  
 
PostPosted: 06 Jan 2013, 20:16 
Simuscape Admin
User avatar

Joined: 15 Sep 2011, 09:25
Posts: 3025
Location: Sweden
That'd be marvellous as it'll take awhile to sort of "move" my most interesting cities from [TTDP] Innovatia to [OTTD] Innovatia... :)

_________________
Image

Simuscape - A world of its own;
SimuTalk | Visual Studio | INFRA Diary

INFRA - Chose Your Destination;
INFRA Projects | INFRA Downloads


Top
 Offline Profile  
 
PostPosted: 06 Jan 2013, 20:27 
Simuscape Admin
User avatar

Joined: 01 May 2012, 11:38
Posts: 580
Knowing you and having seen Innovatia, you won't settle for "okej".. Innovatia in OTTD has to be perfect so I guess it will a long time ;)

_________________
Image

Simuscape
Site Admin & Developer


Top
 Offline Profile  
 
PostPosted: 06 Jan 2013, 20:31 
Simuscape Admin
User avatar

Joined: 15 Sep 2011, 09:25
Posts: 3025
Location: Sweden
I don't understand the word "okey"... :P

But yes, I imagine I can make them twice as great as I do find them now... :)

_________________
Image

Simuscape - A world of its own;
SimuTalk | Visual Studio | INFRA Diary

INFRA - Chose Your Destination;
INFRA Projects | INFRA Downloads


Top
 Offline Profile  
 
PostPosted: 06 Jan 2013, 23:40 
Player
Player

Joined: 12 Mar 2012, 02:39
Posts: 469
You need to be careful about that. Creating a scenario in OpenTTD with a number of GRFs in use during the scenario creation session can cause serious problems, if those very same GRFs are not being used while playing the game. Even replacing these GRFs with updates can have an impact.

I've tried to create a scenario with Canadian v1.x GRFs, then playing the game with v2.x GRFs resulted in an unplayable situation.


Top
 Offline Profile  
 
PostPosted: 07 Jan 2013, 00:13 
Simuscape Admin
User avatar

Joined: 15 Sep 2011, 09:25
Posts: 3025
Location: Sweden
Okey, I see your point. Is it possible to load the scenario editor and start terraforming a new scenario without adding any newgrf's at all until it's time to launch the game?

_________________
Image

Simuscape - A world of its own;
SimuTalk | Visual Studio | INFRA Diary

INFRA - Chose Your Destination;
INFRA Projects | INFRA Downloads


Top
 Offline Profile  
 
PostPosted: 07 Jan 2013, 00:18 
Player
Player

Joined: 12 Mar 2012, 02:39
Posts: 469
SAC wrote:
Okey, I see your point. Is it possible to load the scenario editor and start terraforming a new scenario without adding any newgrf's at all until it's time to launch the game?
That should work of course.


Top
 Offline Profile  
 
PostPosted: 07 Jan 2013, 00:21 
Master Mentor
User avatar

Joined: 27 Feb 2012, 22:45
Posts: 1550
Location: Canada
SAC wrote:
Is it possible to load the scenario editor and start terraforming a new scenario without adding any newgrf's at all until it's time to launch the game?
I think the game will complain if there are no towns, but it should allow you to continue. There might be some things not buildable without towns though.

_________________
Visit SimuSchool - Tutorials, Questions and Answers
TTDPatch Nightlies Downloads are back
Thrive


Top
 Offline Profile  
 
PostPosted: 07 Jan 2013, 00:37 
Simuscape Admin
User avatar

Joined: 15 Sep 2011, 09:25
Posts: 3025
Location: Sweden
wallyweb wrote:
I think the game will complain if there are no towns, but it should allow you to continue. There might be some things not buildable without towns though.


I think you misunderstood me... I'm thinking of installing OTTD and then launch the scenario editor and start terraforming the terrain, adding cities and such, but not adding any newgrf's until I'm ready to start playing the scenario in OTTD - which won't happen until "you know what" is implemented in "you know what... :twisted:

_________________
Image

Simuscape - A world of its own;
SimuTalk | Visual Studio | INFRA Diary

INFRA - Chose Your Destination;
INFRA Projects | INFRA Downloads


Top
 Offline Profile  
 
PostPosted: 07 Jan 2013, 00:46 
Master Mentor
User avatar

Joined: 27 Feb 2012, 22:45
Posts: 1550
Location: Canada
SAC wrote:
I'm thinking of installing OTTD and then launch the scenario editor and start terraforming the terrain, adding cities and such, but not adding any newgrf's until I'm ready to start playing the scenario in OTTD
That will work. I often do this even with TTDP.

Quote:
- which won't happen until "you know what" is implemented in "you know what... :twisted:
"I know what" :lol:

_________________
Visit SimuSchool - Tutorials, Questions and Answers
TTDPatch Nightlies Downloads are back
Thrive


Top
 Offline Profile  
 
PostPosted: 07 Jan 2013, 01:06 
Player
Player

Joined: 12 Mar 2012, 02:39
Posts: 469
wallyweb wrote:
SAC wrote:
Is it possible to load the scenario editor and start terraforming a new scenario without adding any newgrf's at all until it's time to launch the game?
I think the game will complain if there are no towns, but it should allow you to continue. There might be some things not buildable without towns though.
Towns should be added in the scenario, but you'll get the default buildings. These will then be replaced gradually with buildings from a buildings set when such GRF is added before playing the scenario.


Top
 Offline Profile  
 
PostPosted: 07 Jan 2013, 01:32 
Simuscape Admin
User avatar

Joined: 15 Sep 2011, 09:25
Posts: 3025
Location: Sweden
Okey then... now I know...

Thank you my friends... :W

_________________
Image

Simuscape - A world of its own;
SimuTalk | Visual Studio | INFRA Diary

INFRA - Chose Your Destination;
INFRA Projects | INFRA Downloads


Top
 Offline Profile  
 
PostPosted: 07 Jan 2013, 08:58 
Lurker
Lurker
User avatar

Joined: 08 Apr 2012, 04:48
Posts: 13
Location: In The Dark
The adding of NewGrfs after a scenario has been created can be done but it can also cause problems that may result in a loss of playability. A scenario is seen by OpenTTD in the exact same way as a save game is. What you can safely do is edit the terrain as much as you like and then export that terrain as a heightmap. Terrain being defined here as anything that does NOT involve NewGrfs; no towns, no tracks, no roads, no trees, etc. I am not sure if rivers translate to heightmaps as yet. When you have all your NewGrf's finished (or OpenTTD is "upgraded" to a playing style that you find useful) you can then import that heightmap into the scenario editor at the same time that you put your NewGrfs in place and then continue to edit your scenario from that point.

_________________
Humor is the second most subjective thing on the planet
--------------------------------------------------
Brevity is the soul of wit and obscenity is its downfall
--------------------------------------------------
Good Night And Good Luck - Read You Soon


Top
 Offline Profile  
 
PostPosted: 07 Jan 2013, 10:36 
Simuscape Admin
User avatar

Joined: 15 Sep 2011, 09:25
Posts: 3025
Location: Sweden
Ah okey! There certainly are some differences between TTDP and OTTD also when it comes to the scenario editor, so many thanks Nite Owl for this information... :W

_________________
Image

Simuscape - A world of its own;
SimuTalk | Visual Studio | INFRA Diary

INFRA - Chose Your Destination;
INFRA Projects | INFRA Downloads


Top
 Offline Profile  
 
PostPosted: 07 Jan 2013, 13:47 
Master Mentor
User avatar

Joined: 27 Feb 2012, 22:45
Posts: 1550
Location: Canada
There should not be a problem with adding GRFs to a scenario in either TTDP or OTTD as long as the added GRFs do not conflict with previously added GRFs.

The real problem arises when one removes a GRF. There can be obscure artifacts remaining on the map.

In both games, features such as industries will persist behind the scenes even if the GRF is removed. TTDP has cheats that allow purging of certain features. As far as I know, OTTD does not.

The best approach is to develop a strategy for scenario building:
- Sequentially number your scenario saves as you add features:
xx0 - Plain terrain - no features
xx1 - Town set added - Towns built
xx2 - Industries added - Industries built
xxetc - Continue pattern for each added feature
This way, if a change is required, you can always restart the process from the previously saved scenario.

_________________
Visit SimuSchool - Tutorials, Questions and Answers
TTDPatch Nightlies Downloads are back
Thrive


Top
 Offline Profile  
 
PostPosted: 07 Jan 2013, 13:58 
Simuscape Admin
User avatar

Joined: 15 Sep 2011, 09:25
Posts: 3025
Location: Sweden
Hmm, I hope playing an OTTD-scenario is a lot easier then creating it... :shock:

_________________
Image

Simuscape - A world of its own;
SimuTalk | Visual Studio | INFRA Diary

INFRA - Chose Your Destination;
INFRA Projects | INFRA Downloads


Top
 Offline Profile  
 
PostPosted: 07 Jan 2013, 14:04 
OpenTTD Developer
User avatar

Joined: 30 Jul 2012, 17:29
Posts: 11
SAC wrote:
Ah okey! There certainly are some differences between TTDP and OTTD also when it comes to the scenario editor, so many thanks Nite Owl for this information... :W

TTDPatch might not complain or show any messages, but that doesn't mean it magically always work.

Generally, not all NewGRFs are equally problematic. OpenTTD disallows modifications by default because it's not easy to which changes are "safe" and which are not. A big problem in that regard is that NewGRFs can change their behavior depending on which other GRFs are present and their parameters, up to disabling themselves.

Except for that adding new vehicles, stations, objects or houses is mostly safe. Removing can be safe too, especially if they aren't used anywhere. GRFs that only replace sprites (e.g. Stolen Trees) are unproblematic as well.

What will likely trip you are GRFs that add, remove or modify cargos, which includes most industry sets. Not that surprising if you know that almost everything in the game except NewObjects interacts with cargos one way or the other. Changes can result in behavior like wrong prices or even undefined cargos unless you are very lucky.


Top
 Offline Profile  
 
PostPosted: 07 Jan 2013, 18:57 
Simuscape Admin
User avatar

Joined: 15 Sep 2011, 09:25
Posts: 3025
Location: Sweden
Even some more things to consider once my journey into the OTTD betins I'll say... :P Thank you Michi_cc... :W

_________________
Image

Simuscape - A world of its own;
SimuTalk | Visual Studio | INFRA Diary

INFRA - Chose Your Destination;
INFRA Projects | INFRA Downloads


Top
 Offline Profile  
 
PostPosted: 08 Jan 2013, 04:55 
Lurker
Lurker
User avatar

Joined: 17 Dec 2012, 08:05
Posts: 9
Location: Toronto
Just to add a recent experience I had - a lovely map was generated for me by OpenTTD and I began playing only to discover that water supplies weren't working (a big problem in a tropical map) plus a number of industries were producing the wrong things, things that shouldn't be present in a tropical game. While it was nice to have all that coal and steel, it spoiled my game a bit and I had to fix it and restart.

The culprit was a missing NewGRF for ECS when the map had generated. Saving as a scenario and tweaking it had no effect.

_________________
Image
"(Locomotion is) one of the best-playing games of its type." -Chris Sawyer


Top
 Offline Profile  
 
Display posts from previous:  Sort by  
Post a new topicPost a reply Page 1 of 2   [ 22 posts ]
Go to page 1, 2  Next


Who is online

Users browsing this forum: No registered users and 1 guest


You cannot post new topics in this forum
You cannot reply to topics in this forum
You cannot edit your posts in this forum
You cannot delete your posts in this forum
You cannot post attachments in this forum

Jump to:  
cron


Status SimuscapeTerms of UseAbout Simuscape

Design by SAC © 2012-2015, Sweden • Powered by phpBB • Based on twilightBB by Daniel St. Jules