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PostPosted: 11 Jun 2012, 20:39 
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Joined: 02 Mar 2012, 11:12
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He did? Im glad of that, and perhaps my comment was a bit hasty, do you have any IRC logs to reflect that, i'd be interested to read conversation to that effect.

Sorry andy, jumped the gun a bit ;)


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PostPosted: 11 Jun 2012, 20:51 
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Yes I do;

12:45 <andythenorth> TrueBrain: after joining Simuscape I read what had happened to Leanden, which you are probably not aware of, wrt a grf drama
12:45 <andythenorth> and it annoyed me that Leanden felt the need to leave tt-forums
12:45 <TrueBrain> andythenorth: ingeneral you can assume I am not up-to-date about drama :P
12:46 <andythenorth> Leanden forked a grf at my recommendation, due to stupidity by the so-called 'community' building it
12:46 <andythenorth> he then got driven off the forums in a bout of stupid drama
12:46 <andythenorth> the people who drove him out are not people who create things mostly, but rather back-seat drive and somewhat bully, or just ask stupid questions
12:46 <TrueBrain> so he got punished for doing something you both considered good?
12:47 <andythenorth> effectively yes
12:47 <TrueBrain> ugh; horrifying
12:47 <andythenorth> then more sensible people jumped on him for going somewhere else and doing closed-doors development
12:47 <TrueBrain> and so the balls rolls and rolls
12:49 <andythenorth> I would raise that with orudge :)

And to further prove this, he actually responded to that thread started by Dave W about "Would Someone Like To Explain To Me..." HERE!

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PostPosted: 11 Jun 2012, 21:02 
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Well that's nice, its good to see that the actions of few don't reflect the community as a whole, but of course this wouldnt reverse my decision, but its still nice to see.


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PostPosted: 12 Jun 2012, 02:17 
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I fail to understand how a copyright infringement can be uploaded so easily in bananas since that is not an automated procedure.

Anyway, my opinion still holds the same: ignore them.

It is a pity that we do not have a good coder among our community so we could maintain our own branch and keep a distance from some OTTD developers.


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PostPosted: 12 Jun 2012, 02:24 
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Our own branch of openttd? While that would be nice, the resultant fallout would be catastrophic!!!


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PostPosted: 12 Jun 2012, 02:56 
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athanasios wrote:
It is a pity that we do not have a good coder among our community so we could maintain our own branch and keep a distance from some OTTD developers.

I'd expect any good coder would want to pool his or her resources with the other OTTD developers. After all, many hands make light work; no need to do everything yourself when you can be one of many contributors, together you can achieve much more in a given timeframe...


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PostPosted: 12 Jun 2012, 12:47 
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athanasios wrote:
I fail to understand how a copyright infringement can be uploaded so easily in bananas since that is not an automated procedure.

Actually, it is entirely automatic. Files aren't checked over by anybody, unless they are reported in some way - just as files uploaded to YouTube or attached to forum posts aren't checked over by anybody. That said, there is a blacklist, and a number of well-known "bad" GRFs (i.e., GRFs that shouldn't be on Bananas) have been added to it. Plus the upload form has been updated with some extra notices and checkboxes to try to discourage people from uploading material they don't have the rights to.

Apparently there have only been a very small handful of cases of copyright infringement like this in the past few years that Bananas has been around, and procedures have now been tightened so that they will be dealt with even more quickly than before, hopefully. Considering the vast majority of people use Bananas responsibly, I'm sure things won't be too much of a problem from now on, and hopefully the blacklist and the additional warnings will prevent perhaps well-meaning but misguided users from uploading the content of others in this way again.

I certainly can't see how forking OpenTTD would really be great for anybody in the community, though. That said, as it is GPL, you are of course welcome to do so if you wish!

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PostPosted: 13 Jun 2012, 01:04 
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It was good for many other projects (like LibreOffice: OpenOffice was getting bloated much like MS Windoze and that had to stop).

And it will help Simuscape artists a lot in producing artwork for material that cannot be currently implemented in OTTD. Art development and Code development have to go hand by hand which IMO some of the developers fail to understand.

Simuscape OTTD isn't intended to sever ties but be a bleeding edge/experimental branch of OTTD much like the numerous patch packs currently available.


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PostPosted: 13 Jun 2012, 01:25 
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athanasios wrote:
And it will help Simuscape artists a lot in producing artwork for material that cannot be currently implemented in OTTD.

Hmm, what kind of art are we talking about here? CBH?

athanasios wrote:
Simuscape OTTD isn't intended to sever ties but be a bleeding edge/experimental branch of OTTD much like the numerous patch packs currently available.

Well, the problem with patchpacks, forks, and the like is they will inevitably be outpaced by trunk development(s) and becoming increasingly hard to maintain as trunk keeps soldiering on.


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PostPosted: 14 Jun 2012, 01:45 
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Any kind of art that cannot be currently implemented in OTTD. It's up to the imagination of the artist and the coder. ;-)
I agree on the latter, especially when there is no structural organization of the development.


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PostPosted: 14 Jun 2012, 12:33 
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I admit that there both good and bad OTTD devs around, just as there are graphics and coding artists around, some of them good, some of them bad - although I would like to add that it's mainly a question of interpretation... :mrgreen:

The main thing, as I see it, is that we find a descent way for us to cope and get along and make this entire TTDLX-community a great place to be part of. We only need to find the right tools to make this happen, and unite around some mutual rules, conditions and the sort between all separate sites, part of the entire TTDLX-family...

A good start is to try to see beyond what's been said and done before, as holding on to "historical" events, arguings, disagreements or conflicts won't create a fundamental ground to start off with... :) We all have a responsibility to make this work, and it would be great to find that in none of our sites there are topics referring to negative things at all... While it may be impossible at all time in a long run is a different story, but to at least have the intentions is an excellent step forward...

Something that may prove to be difficult is obviously the "umbrella" thing... At times it feels as if this new approach to get things to work is merely a shortcut to reach files that are currently hosted on Simuscape - but not over at the BaNaNaS... I have suggested mutual descriptions as far as copyrights, policies and the sort concerns, I have suggested that OpenTTD.org becomes the umbrella for the entire TTDLX community as it is in fact a neutral place - and OTTD is the game that is the vast majorities choice when it comes to TTDLX, and that's how it is going to stay. My current preference is TTDP but that has to do with other various reasons, and is in no way something I can or will include in this discussion what so ever. I need to view this in a realistic way, and a realistic way is that it all comes down to OTTD, and and as OpenTTD.org is the home for that. Not Simuscape. Not TT-forums. Not TT-MS Headquarters or any other native languaged site out there... We are sites focusing on and developing custom files for use with TTDLX, and it is a fact that TT-forums is no longer the only international site around. And as such - despite the difference in size - we're similar sites.

I admit that OTTD devs are basically present on TT-forums, but that's the result of TT-forums being the only international site where people have been able to join in and participate for a very long time. This isn't the case anymore. Simuscape is small. Very small, but we've grown quite rapidly during the few months we've been online, and while a vast majority of all TTDLX members posting is doing this over at TT-forums, it's important to realize that most of those posts aren't even related to TTDLX but off-topic issues and matters... From my point of view it's completely unrealistic to view TT-forums as some sort of an "umbrella" for the entire TTDLX family....

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